The Sanctuary
Ego => Spurious Generalities => Topic started by: Arnox on August 23, 2014, 10:11:43 am
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It's probably been down for a while now but I've just now realized it.
*sigh*
And with it dies the name of totse. We all knew this day was going to come. No doubt about it. Idio locking up totse2 was one thing, but to see it down completely... I guess it kinda took with it that last illusion of the site still being with us...
And where are we now? We've come a long way, but at the same time, we're now beginning to take so many steps back. The core userbase is shrinking with little to no explanation as to why despite my best efforts. This site started with a lot of promise. We had a good foundation and now it's breaking apart. Why? Because people are not posting for whatever reason.
Is it the meth fans? No. They're all gone.
Is it the site? No. The site has more than enough features to accommodate the community and is fast and streamlined enough.
Is it the staff? No. No abuse has ever been perpetrated.
Is it the rules? No. They're incredibly light rules as compared to most all forums and are very reasonable.
So what is it then? I have no idea. I really don't. But I will say this. Guys, we can and are killing this forum with cynicism. I am not exaggerating. You all can keep pointing fingers at what's wrong, but at the end of the day, by not posting, you guys are doing more damage than most anything else I can think of. If you guys do not post, sooner or later, this forum is going to die. If you find that that does not bother you, fine. Leave. No sense in supporting a place you don't really care about. But if you do, if you cared even a little bit about this site and what it stands for, then you need to post. That's all there is to it now.
I've done almost everything I can and will continue to do so. I will support this forum with my own posts and keep it up for a long time. Even if no one else will post at all, I will still be here. Of that you can be sure. But I can't be a community. And I can only keep this song and dance up for so long. You guys need to carry it the rest of the way.
If you will all work with me though, if we even had 3 more people posting who did not before, we can start to get this going again. And it will be much easier to bring in new members from elsewhere of course if they know there's people to talk to. If we can do even that, we can begin to rebuild and start on the road to something truly great.
Totse2 is now finished. But I am still here. We are still here. And I will fight to my last breath to keep this site going because I believe in it. The question is, do you?
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Shit site is shit.
/me goes back on to reddit.
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The problem is pretty clear you never listened to your user base when you had it for a crucial period, and you drove a lot of people away with your attitude. You can go ahead and blame everyone else if you want but don't delude yourself into thinking you did everything right.
I warned you plenty of times (as did others) you were driving people away and not creating an environment for discussion and look at that, people were driven away and there's no discussion.
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Re: Site improvement thread
« Reply #6 on: August 17, 2014, 03:28:14 AM »
The forum totse2.darkbb.com doesn't exist
It appears that totse2.darkbb.com has been deleted. If that is the case we lost the notice that Idio posted about the closing and this site. Is there any other way that members, former members and guest of totse2.darkbb.com and totse2.com can find us here?
It's been gone for about a week.
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Such a shame , although I did not post I did read , especialy Kaa Fucking Boom and the Erotic tales . I gained a lot of information on some dodgy stuff . It is a great site . :)
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Just been too damn busy with college stuff. Aviation doesn't leave you with a whole lot of free time. :-\
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Just been too damn busy with college stuff. Aviation doesn't leave you with a whole lot of free time. :-\
Ditto. Working 12 hours a day monday-friday, trying to learn at a steady pace on khan academy, maintaining a social life, gaming, rebuilding my own life from a reckless addiction, and other stuff i'm probably forgetting adds up. I want to help but I honestly don't know what to really post about. I've made a few threads in BLTC that aren't even about drugs, just chemistry in general and nobody's answered those.
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I warned you plenty of times (as did others) you were driving people away and not creating an environment for discussion and look at that, people were driven away and there's no discussion.
But that's not what I asked in the end. Do you want to leave or do you want to stay?
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I warned you plenty of times (as did others) you were driving people away and not creating an environment for discussion and look at that, people were driven away and there's no discussion.
But that's not what I asked in the end. Do you want to leave or do you want to stay?
Actually I can read and that's not what you asked at the end you said, "And I will fight to my last breath to keep this site going because I believe in it. The question is, do you?" so to answer you no I don't believe in the site and your dismissive and condescending attitude in your post is a great example of why.
Totse2 is now finished. But I am still here. We are still here. And I will fight to my last breath to keep this site going because I believe in it. The question is, do you?
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Re: Site improvement thread
« Reply #6 on: August 17, 2014, 03:28:14 AM »
The forum totse2.darkbb.com doesn't exist
It appears that totse2.darkbb.com has been deleted. If that is the case we lost the notice that Idio posted about the closing and this site. Is there any other way that members, former members and guest of totse2.darkbb.com and totse2.com can find us here?
It's been gone for about a week.
Hm. Must have missed it.
I warned you plenty of times (as did others) you were driving people away and not creating an environment for discussion and look at that, people were driven away and there's no discussion.
But that's not what I asked in the end. Do you want to leave or do you want to stay?
Actually I can read and that's not what you asked at the end you said, "And I will fight to my last breath to keep this site going because I believe in it. The question is, do you?"
I think you know what I mean.
I have actually been trying to be patient with you and your constant negativity but I think I'm finished now. There's just no pleasing you. I'm not gonna bend down and beg you to stay if that's what you want. I've listened to you, I've talked, I've tried to compromise but now I'm done. You can stay here if you want or you can leave. Either way though, I'm tired of hearing about this "attitude" you seem to be the only one seeing. Personally, I think it's rather hilarious and pathetic that someone's "attitude" of all things is driving you away and not actual, you know, actions. The things that actually matter.
TL;DR - Get TUFF or go away. Or I guess you could stay and complain some more about my evil "attitude", but I'll be laughing the entire time.
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yeah I'm sure the only one seeing it that's why your sites bustling with activity
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Shit site is shit.
/me goes back on to reddit.
Shiva, This is your conscience speaking. Your acting like an asshole!
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Shiva, This is your conscience speaking. Your acting like an asshole!
Where were you this entire time, conscience?
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I thought about making some type of announcement or decree, but I figured that it would be noticed in due time. It was best for me to let it have more of a silent departure, if you will. The notice ran for about 3 months, so those who would have benefited from it, and us from them, have probably mostly been realized.
As for what lies on the other side of the coin of totse2, the side that is not darkened only by the shadow of what once was, but by the scorch of what can never be again, I do not know. If one were to turn it over, we would not see the face of what we trust or the relic of what we came to know, but rather a ghost of what could have been and a projection of what we remember it becoming.
I exchanged a couple PM's on the topic with a particular forumite here, whom may reveal his or her self if he or he so chooses. Though it may not directly relate to the topic at hand here, I thought I would mention my final thoughts before cutting off life support:
"Hey man, how's it going. I've been considering what you said, but I have decided that I have closed that chapter in my life. It was a great run, but totse2 has changed a bit from what it once was. I really think it is best to continue with how things are now, and I think the time is right to fully close up shop.
I know you said it felt great to log back in, and I share those feelings with you, but totse2 is only an idea. Totse is an idea. The sanctuary is an idea. The idea and philosophy has been embedded in all of us, in our way of thinking, and has influenced all of our behavior and perception of life and what it had to offer. That being said, no matter what website we're on or what we call home, we will always be totseans. That is the one thing that has brought us together. As much as some people say totse is dead, I believe that it will always be alive within us. Even if the giant plug of the internet were pulled, people would still be experiencing totse by interacting with us. This is because of one common drive. We are totse."
To come full circle, I think we don't need to worry as much about what we want to be, and just be. Sure, it's good to an objective, or mission statement of sorts. But we have that. It is to continue on where we left off. And that is in the perpetuation of the ideas of free thinking, untamed ideas, and open discussions. That's at least what goes on in my head about this place.
But I do get where you're coming from. I used to have encounters in life that made me think, "Man, I should post that on [insert website here]." It wasn't necessarily because I thought it was stimulate a ton of page views or responses, but because I knew the community would get it. It would get me.
Has that sense of community been displaced? Maybe. Is it gone and lost forever? No. All we have to do is be. Be what we are, and forget about how we want to be perceived. The rest will come, but not until we can define ourselves and remember our own identities.
If you can't be yourself here, amongst the confidence and shroud of anonymity, the inclusion of community, and the freedom from societal constraints, then where can you be yourself? Do you remember who you are? Come to The Sanctuary. We'll help you find yourself. Then we'll let you be who you are.
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"Hey man, how's it going. I've been considering what you said, but I have decided that I have closed that chapter in my life. It was a great run, but totse2 has changed a bit from what it once was. I really think it is best to continue with how things are now, and I think the time is right to fully close up shop.
I know you said it felt great to log back in, and I share those feelings with you, but totse2 is only an idea. Totse is an idea. The sanctuary is an idea. The idea and philosophy has been embedded in all of us, in our way of thinking, and has influenced all of our behavior and perception of life and what it had to offer. That being said, no matter what website we're on or what we call home, we will always be totseans. That is the one thing that has brought us together. As much as some people say totse is dead, I believe that it will always be alive within us. Even if the giant plug of the internet were pulled, people would still be experiencing totse by interacting with us. This is because of one common drive. We are totse."
I am so glad that you posted this. I hope every member reads it. I shared your pm to me with Arnox yesterday. He sounded a little down. I want to thank you for considering my pm. I accepted and respect your decision 100%. When I was able to log into totse2darkbb along with tungsten a few weeks ago I sent you a pm from there. Did you ever get the chance to read it? If not it said " Yo Bitch!! I'm still here!". I believe that the last pm sent at totse2 was by me and the last one at totse2 to receive a pm was you. See, we are connected again. I love you brother!
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I thought about making some type of announcement or decree, but I figured that it would be noticed in due time. It was best for me to let it have more of a silent departure, if you will. The notice ran for about 3 months, so those who would have benefited from it, and us from them, have probably mostly been realized.
snip
(http://i.imgur.com/79ERQFb.gif)
I might have to immortalize this post somewhere on the site. :/
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Thank you for running one of the best sites on the web for all these years , it must have taken a great deal of your time . I apologise for not posting , no excuse .
I cannot understand the vitriol being post against you , it is ungracious and undeserved .
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I am so glad that you posted this. I hope every member reads it. I shared your pm to me with Arnox yesterday. He sounded a little down. I want to thank you for considering my pm. I accepted and respect your decision 100%. When I was able to log into totse2darkbb along with tungsten a few weeks ago I sent you a pm from there. Did you ever get the chance to read it? If not it said " Yo Bitch!! I'm still here!". I believe that the last pm sent at totse2 was by me and the last one at totse2 to receive a pm was you. See, we are connected again. I love you brother!
I did read that PM. The guard was asleep on the job that day and some riffraff snuck in haha. You're right though, you sent the last PM of totse2 and I received the last PM of totse2, so we do have something special.
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Shit site is shit.
/me goes back on to reddit.
Shiva, This is your conscience speaking. Your acting like an asshole!
Pretty sure I abandoned my conscience that second time I did shrooms. Also my conscience had better grammar.
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Fuck nigga, why would it torment you to know totse2 is offline when we have this new place here in which we can do what we do. I know boo hoo no mas totse for us. But lets face it totse died with totse. Totse2 was totse2 not totse and it dies with totse2. Sanctuary is sanctuary neither totse nor totse2.
It seems we have a case of standing and looking behind us rather than looking ahead and walking forward.
So long totse's. You had your run but now it is time for the Sanctum.
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It seems we have a case of standing and looking behind us rather than looking ahead and walking forward.
I'm trying but every time I do, we have people like...
yeah I'm sure the only one seeing it that's why your sites bustling with activity
(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/14/26/98/51/thisgu10.jpg)
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Every site will have a troll. It's best not to pay them any more attention than necessary. At least they spark discussion though, right?
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More like a poor admin that can handle he might be part of the reason his site's not doing well but sure we'll call it trolling when someone calls him out on it
cause I had such a track record of trolling on the previous site
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Simply calling someone out on something has rarely had a positive effect, other than adding entertainment value, in any situation. If you want to discuss the etimology of the word troll, then it's disruptive, emotionally provocative, and generally does nothing but upset people, though we should have thicker skin if hanging around these parts.
Do you have any serious suggestions, with clear, attainable, and measurable goals? Can you motivate people to achieve these goals? I ask with earnest because is what a good leader is to do in his or her stripped down essence. I know you didn't offer to lead this place Spectre, but don't criticize the only one who has stepped up with good ideas, initiative, and follow through.
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I've brought up more than enough discussion in the shout box and in the irc with Arnox repeatedly, and the fact that his abrasive nature does not bring users or discussion to the site is pretty evident by the point I brought up that there are barely any users or discussions ON the site. It isn't a statement made to "troll" it's a statement of fact the only direction Arnox hasn't looked to when asking why the site is dying is himself.
Also if all it took to not get criticized was the ability to host a website we should all be on Zoklet huh
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I'm at both sites. Each one has their differences and serve different purposes.
I'm not saying you're wrong about everything Spectre, just saying there are more constructive ways to approach the issue and have your voice heard.
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Unfortunately "constructive" ways haven't particularly got through to some people
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Right did a big comment now it gone wtf
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I've brought up more than enough discussion in the shout box and in the irc with Arnox repeatedly, and the fact that his abrasive nature does not bring users or discussion to the site is pretty evident by the point I brought up that there are barely any users or discussions ON the site. It isn't a statement made to "troll" it's a statement of fact the only direction Arnox hasn't looked to when asking why the site is dying is himself.
Also if all it took to not get criticized was the ability to host a website we should all be on Zoklet huh
Fine, let me ask you something else. Besides my "attitude", what else do you see wrong with this site right now?
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Fine, let me ask you something else. Besides my "attitude", what else do you see wrong with this site right now?
That's the problem YOU are what's wrong with this site right now. Anyone can own and operate a website but if people have issues with someone who is owning and operating the website they likely won't use it. You're so unwilling to admit you might be doing something wrong but your interactions with a lot of users who haven't come back to the site are really poor.
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(http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140306235947/clubpenguinpookie/images/3/32/Grumpy_Cat_Good.jpg)
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Specter are you trying to hold a coup? Arnox may be a little wired but if was not for him you would be here gassing on and on, its better to have loved and lost then neaver to have loved at all.
He has banned me for petty reasons and we rearly see eye to eye and I keep coming back way cause I dont come here for his ramblings I come for the people allready here.
Yes arnox has made mistakes any here want to stand up and say they have never made one? His biggest mistake was banning I.S he was good for si4e pissed me and alot off people off, he can make up for this all tho I think it could be to late. PROP 187 bring I.S back
Idlo your words as allways are beautifull can read your posts all day haha
I like what Sig said totse no more get the ffuck over it its a site at the end off the day, id hate to see some you in a break up.
Shiva dont leave I will miss you
As for content I stop post loads cause I got banned for trying to laid I some the staff here may not no they have sexual organs but the rest off world dose and I played on is, my tags have some off the most searched word ever
Will edit latter on shitty tablet
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:pansies: :pansies: :pansies:
"Can we all get along?"
Rodney King
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That's the problem YOU are what's wrong with this site right now. Anyone can own and operate a website but if people have issues with someone who is owning and operating the website they likely won't use it. You're so unwilling to admit you might be doing something wrong but your interactions with a lot of users who haven't come back to the site are really poor.
Holy crap, son. Jeff was 10 times harsher than I was, not counting Zok and countless other admins and mods.
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p, son. Jeff was 10 times harsher than I was, not counting Zok and countless other admins and mods.
I'm not saying you're harsh I'm saying you suck at interacting with people. Not your rules and enforcement or whatever but just dealing with you in general aka your ATTITUDE to users and especially your staff.
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I'm not saying you're harsh I'm saying you suck at interacting with people. Not your rules and enforcement or whatever but just dealing with you in general aka your ATTITUDE to users and especially your staff.
Sorry, don't see it. Perhaps you can point out specific instances where I was supposedly being terrible.
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Sorry, don't see it. Perhaps you can point out specific instances where I was supposedly being terrible.
Well there's a lot of times you've been extremely dismissive ^ that post is a great example of your unwillingness to even be open to the idea that you may be butting heads with staff and users. I'm not going to sit here and write an enumerated list seeing as you likely won't even take it seriously, but I have been present while you act like a knob to your moderator in IRC and I've seen you act like a douche in threads where someone actually contributes http://www.intosanctuary.com/index.php?topic=347.0 < this thread is a good example of your poor interactions as an admin.
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That's a great example of why I don't make time to post new threads.
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Recipe for chimichurri tacos?
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/9974381/2014/2014-05-10%2020.20.58.jpg)
LOL DONT THINK SO
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Recipe for chimichurri tacos?
LOL DONT THINK SO
But... why?
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Recipe for chimichurri tacos?
LOL DONT THINK SO
But... why?
Wow, an actual contribution. :tup:
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Well there's a lot of times you've been extremely dismissive ^ that post is a great example of your unwillingness to even be open to the idea that you may be butting heads with staff and users. I'm not going to sit here and write an enumerated list seeing as you likely won't even take it seriously, but I have been present while you act like a knob to your moderator in IRC and I've seen you act like a douche in threads where someone actually contributes http://www.intosanctuary.com/index.php?topic=347.0 < this thread is a good example of your poor interactions as an admin.
That's a great example of why I don't make time to post new threads.
You know, I was about to go on this lengthy explanation about all the things that were mentioned here but then I realize that talking to either of you would probably be pointless. You're both going to argue with/ignore everything I say I think.
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Well there's a lot of times you've been extremely dismissive ^ that post is a great example of your unwillingness to even be open to the idea that you may be butting heads with staff and users. I'm not going to sit here and write an enumerated list seeing as you likely won't even take it seriously, but I have been present while you act like a knob to your moderator in IRC and I've seen you act like a douche in threads where someone actually contributes http://www.intosanctuary.com/index.php?topic=347.0 < this thread is a good example of your poor interactions as an admin.
That's a great example of why I don't make time to post new threads.
You know, I was about to go on this lengthy explanation about all the things that were mentioned here but then I realize that talking to either of you would probably be pointless. You're both going to argue with/ignore everything I say I think.
Wow, an actual contribution. :tup:
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You know, I was about to go on this lengthy explanation about all the things that were mentioned here but then I realize that talking to either of you would probably be pointless. You're both going to argue with/ignore everything I say I think.
Great example of your dismissive and condescending attitude
Idio I hope you see why constructive doesn't work sorry you hooked yourself to another poor admin.
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Wow, an actual contribution. :tup:
> Complains about not getting treated very nicely.
> Starts posting spam.
Great example of your dismissive and condescending attitude
Great example of your willingness to settle down and not be so confrontational. Or should I say, your unwillingness. All you're doing at this point is giving me more reasons NOT to listen to you.
Throughout the entire time you've been here, I don't think you've said a single positive thing about this site or me. You have not given me any evidence to the contrary that you'll be satisfied with anything I do. So I ask you, why should I even bother? Tell me or just leave. Because if I see another post from you telling me how I'm Satan, I'm just gonna start ignoring you.
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>tells user to post specific examples of his bad attitude
>gets mad and dismissive when user does it
>gets mad that user points out the exact reason his interactions are poor again
>tells user to leave cause he doesn't get praised by said user
Yeah you're right you're totally showing the behaviors of a good admin on an internet forum. I am definitely personally attacking you when posting examples and proving your dismissive reaction to users by highlighting your own responses.
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Spectre, why are you so concerned about this? FFS this is a forum site and out of all the topics you can post in you seem just centered on bashing Arnox. Newsflash, people make fucking mistakes from time to time. Unless theres someone pointing a gun at your head saying "get back on that forum and fix this shit" then chill the fuck out. If you don't like the way the site is being run then like arnox said, fucking leave, nobody is forcing you to stay.
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sorry you think answering the admins questions is "bashing" him
:^)
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>tells user to post specific examples of his bad attitude
>gets mad and dismissive when user does it
Nope. Actually, I wondered why I should bother explaining myself to you if you're going to argue with everything I say and then you validated my view further by being confrontational some more.
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Nope. Actually, I wondered why I should bother explaining myself to you if you're going to argue with everything I say and then you validated my view further by being confrontational some more.
Yeah see however that's not true. I very clearly answered the question you posed and by definition not explaining your self is dismissive especially after you posed the question to me. I don't believe you understand what confrontational actually is if you think someone bringing up instances of fact to support their standpoint is confrontational.
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Yeah see however that's not true. I very clearly answered the question you posed and by definition not explaining your self is dismissive especially after you posed the question to me. I don't believe you understand what confrontational actually is if you think someone bringing up instances of fact to support their standpoint is confrontational.
So you're honestly telling me that if I explained myself, you would listen? Seriously, be honest.
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So you're honestly telling me that if I explained myself, you would listen? Seriously, be honest.
I would certainly read a point of view you hold about yourself. However I fail to see how an explanation of dismissive behavior and poor interactions somehow changes it to not dismissive behavior and poor interactions. I never asked for an explanation of WHY you're dismissive and not good at interacting in my post with the thread link, you're the one that stated,
You know, I was about to go on this lengthy explanation about all the things that were mentioned here but then I realize that talking to either of you would probably be pointless. You're both going to argue with/ignore everything I say I think.
In response to me answering your question of specifically pointing out times your attitude was bad. Explaining why your attitude to users and your team sucks doesn't make your attitude to your team and users not suck.
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Arnox, here is your issue:
1. You dismiss what certain users have to say about you and the site. Sure you may not wanna hear it but it is feedback. And evaluating that feedback is what will make you a good admin.
2. You don't even try to explain yourself. Sure they may not read it but posting an explanation is a hell of a lot better than just posting a one line comment stating your view.
3. You think that since you made this forum we should like you or all be buddies. Unfortunately the whole ideology totse and sites of that nature is antiauthoritarian. So simply by being in a position of power most of the users are not going to like you.
4. You allow yourself to get into flame wars with the users. A great example is in the link a user provided to a thread called "Real Salsa". Does it really matter how much BS a user posts as long as they post SOMETHING of value?
Everyone else, here is your issue:
1. You don't fucking post enough. How can we have a forum with 5 new posts a day on average?
2. You shit on anything that doesn't interest you. Why do so many of you stupid fucks go into a thread and just post some bullshit? What is the point? It just makes us look bad when people scroll through our threads to see some good information for the first few posts then everything is derailed by one person posting something off topic just to piss everyone off.
3. You think the admin is more self righteous than he really is. No he doesn't think himself Moses building an ark for lost totseans he simply made a site where we can carry on the spirit.
TL/DR
If you don't particularly care for what Arnox has to say why should he care for your criticisms?
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I agree with you Σ on all but a few points and I think it's simply because you missed the beginning of the interactions with users and mods. This attitude has persisted from the very inception of the site and I feel that's why a lot of people aren't willing to listen to Arnox seriously. Almost all the regulars from &T2 aren't around here and I've talked to them and seen the discussions in the irc about their issues with his attitude. Every time the site has shown signs of a downward trend we get messages and posts like the one in the OP blaming users. I'd also disagree with your point of us thinking he's more self righteous than he really is seeing as he feels very much entitled to constant praise.
I really do see where you're coming from but if you were here from the very start you'd have seen a trend of this behavior and a rapidly evaporating user base that already is reenacting the same behaviors of &T2 before it.
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I have questioned his attitude towards certain users but I somewhat understand it. Oppenheimer is one of them, his avatar is a butthole. If it were not for that fact I would really like oppenheimer. He usually has some good stuff to say and isn't as much of a shitposter as I thought he would be. He is like the guy with the great personality but a butthole for a face, I cant hate him for having a butthole face but I can judge him for it. Fang is a different situation. He can post amazing content but he has a butthole for a heart. He doesn't give a fuck about anything other than his own lolz. I dont blame him but it can get a little... destructive to say the least and that can be an issue for me. I don't get what arnox has against Spectre though. I dont see him as having any butthole body parts other than his butthole.
And while I am on the topic of discussing my feelings of certain users here is a special message just for Shiva:
My Dearest Shiva,
Not a day goes by that I do not think of you. I have begun to wonder if you read my letters or if they go straight to the fire. If they do, I cant say I blame you. I know we didn't end on a good note even though you were nice enough to say you "just needed some time to figure yourself out" and there cant be an us before there is a solid foundation in you but I promise I have changed. I no longer look look at other women because I have realized that the only woman worth looking at is you. I have been doing the dishes. I know it really bugged you that I didn't do them. I also have considered your comments about having children before you broke it off. I was scared and sure I wouldn't be a good father but I am ready now. I want us to have two beautiful children, a house with a white picket fence and most importantly I want you back. You don't need to answer now but please at least consider the effort I have made to make myself better for you. I long to hear a reply from you and will wait for as long as it takes, even if that is an eternity. Because, Shiva, I love you and I need you in my life. I was a fool and will do anything for you to take me back. I hope to hear from you but I understand if it is just too difficult for you.
With the greatest love one can feel,
Σ
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I'm not sure where to begin.
Arnox, you're a good guy. I think you're feeling a little bit of admin's remorse. You've put a lot of effort into this site and I understand that you want all the cards to fall as planned. But please understand that a community forum is a living, breathing, and most importantly changing organism. I don't mean to imply that you are doing this, but we cannot control the thoughts or the behavior at large of the user-base. You can influence, and you are in a great position to be of influence, but not everyone will react in the way you had planned. I know there are rules, but unless someone is seriously disrupting the flow of the site, then sometimes we just need to let it go.
So what is key to being successful? In my opinion, it is to never lose your cool. I can tell that you are restraining yourself, which is good, but I try to never respond to something immediately if it gets my emotions going. Participating in discussion is good; I'm not saying not to do that. Sometimes I just have to step away from the keyboard before responding.
To everyone else, I expect you to be doing what you are doing. I'm not saying that Arnox is entirely in the wrong, but speaking up like you have been means that you care, and I like that. There is no reason that people can't discuss touchy subjects, especially about the core of their own self.
That being said, Arnox can only provide the framework of this place. The community is not this website, just as the church is not its building. We, the users, are the community. I want you to continue being vocal about things about which you are passionate, but keep your expectations in check. You will only get out of something what you put in it. There are outliers, meaning some put in more than they get, and some get more than they put in, but generally we have to manage ourselves as a community.
This is a touchy area for leadership. The role of leadership is to motivate. Rarely is the role to intervene and discontinue an activity because the community is like the market. Outside of a few enforced regulations, it will, and needs to be allowed to, manage itself.
So where does that leave the community? Your role is to engage. Engage however you can, however you want. Test the boundaries (you're good at this), but be observant. We don't need to stop and have round table discussions all the time about the mechanics of how to discuss. Just do it.
I'm not sure where to end or if I even said anything. The great thing is, you can challenge me. Just don't do it in an immature way. I love logical discussion, and that is what will win here. Challenge what we know or think we know. Push others. Push yourself.
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Well there's a lot of times you've been extremely dismissive ^ that post is a great example of your unwillingness to even be open to the idea that you may be butting heads with staff and users. I'm not going to sit here and write an enumerated list seeing as you likely won't even take it seriously, but I have been present while you act like a knob to your moderator in IRC and I've seen you act like a douche in threads where someone actually contributes http://www.intosanctuary.com/index.php?topic=347.0 < this thread is a good example of your poor interactions as an admin.
That's a great example of why I don't make time to post new threads.
You know, I was about to go on this lengthy explanation about all the things that were mentioned here but then I realize that talking to either of you would probably be pointless. You're both going to argue with/ignore everything I say I think.
Wow, an actual contribution. :tup:
This website is such a fucking joke.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/9974381/2014/arn.jpg)
Arnox gave me a warning for posting EXACTLY THE SAME THING he posted in my thread. When he does it it's ok. When someone else does it it's spam.
This is why the site is shit and dead.
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I have questioned his attitude towards certain users but I somewhat understand it. Oppenheimer is one of them, his avatar is a butthole. If it were not for that fact I would really like oppenheimer. He usually has some good stuff to say and isn't as much of a shitposter as I thought he would be. He is like the guy with the great personality but a butthole for a face, I cant hate him for having a butthole face but I can judge him for it. Fang is a different situation. He can post amazing content but he has a butthole for a heart. He doesn't give a fuck about anything other than his own lolz. I dont blame him but it can get a little... destructive to say the least and that can be an issue for me. I don't get what arnox has against Spectre though. I dont see him as having any butthole body parts other than his butthole.
And while I am on the topic of discussing my feelings of certain users here is a special message just for Shiva:
My Dearest Shiva,
Not a day goes by that I do not think of you. I have begun to wonder if you read my letters or if they go straight to the fire. If they do, I cant say I blame you. I know we didn't end on a good note even though you were nice enough to say you "just needed some time to figure yourself out" and there cant be an us before there is a solid foundation in you but I promise I have changed. I no longer look look at other women because I have realized that the only woman worth looking at is you. I have been doing the dishes. I know it really bugged you that I didn't do them. I also have considered your comments about having children before you broke it off. I was scared and sure I wouldn't be a good father but I am ready now. I want us to have two beautiful children, a house with a white picket fence and most importantly I want you back. You don't need to answer now but please at least consider the effort I have made to make myself better for you. I long to hear a reply from you and will wait for as long as it takes, even if that is an eternity. Because, Shiva, I love you and I need you in my life. I was a fool and will do anything for you to take me back. I hope to hear from you but I understand if it is just too difficult for you.
With the greatest love one can feel,
Σ
My posting isn't destructive. It's all constructive. Moronic mormons like arnox can't properly interpret what it is I'm actually saying/doing when I post. My content is constructive. My feedback is constructive. You have to read it properly. I explained this in depth on totse2. People don't want to deal with a fucktard like arnox running the show because he's incompetent and has no idea how to moderate anything. Look at the warning he issued me for "spam" as a prime example of why this forum will not last.
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This website is such a fucking joke.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/9974381/2014/arn.jpg)
Arnox gave me a warning for posting EXACTLY THE SAME THING he posted in my thread. When he does it it's ok. When someone else does it it's spam.
This is why the site is shit and dead.
This is the kind of attitude I'm finding here he has a wildly swinging scale based on how he feels on a personal level. He sets a very bad precedent and example of how to act on the site.
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Arnox, here is your issue:
1. You dismiss what certain users have to say about you and the site. Sure you may not wanna hear it but it is feedback. And evaluating that feedback is what will make you a good admin.
2. You don't even try to explain yourself. Sure they may not read it but posting an explanation is a hell of a lot better than just posting a one line comment stating your view.
3. You think that since you made this forum we should like you or all be buddies. Unfortunately the whole ideology totse and sites of that nature is antiauthoritarian. So simply by being in a position of power most of the users are not going to like you.
4. You allow yourself to get into flame wars with the users. A great example is in the link a user provided to a thread called "Real Salsa". Does it really matter how much BS a user posts as long as they post SOMETHING of value?
Alright then.
1. Believe it or not, I have thought about EVERY single thing that's been said about this site and about me. I have considered it all, even when it looks like I haven't. Having said that though,
2. I don't always state my reasons because as you said, I think it will fall on deaf ears, and then I'm just wasting my time. But if the people who actually listen do still want an explanation as well, I will give such from now on for them if anything else.
3. I expect people to judge me by my actions as an admin. If they don't like those, fine. But to not like me simply because I'm the current establishment... That's just flat out immature and retarded and I just can't say that I respect that exactly, you know? I do see what you're saying though.
4. See, I find that thread to be really funny because fanglekai singled out the joking part and completely ignored the other part where I gave him some praise for his contribution. Then he started getting very dramatic and butthurt. Now, should I have involved myself further in such? Debateable. Probably not. Either way though, I found the whole thing rather silly to say the least.
Arnox gave me a warning for posting EXACTLY THE SAME THING he posted in my thread. When he does it it's ok. When someone else does it it's spam.
(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/14/26/98/51/scoutl10.gif)
You got a warning for posting the same exact thing twice in this thread, not for posting the same thing I did.
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3. I expect people to judge me by my actions as an admin. If they don't like those, fine. But to not like me simply because I'm the current establishment... That's just flat out immature and retarded and I just can't say that I respect that exactly, you know? I do see what you're saying though.
4. See, I find that thread to be really funny because fanglekai singled out the joking part and completely ignored the other part where I gave him some praise for his contribution. Then he started getting very dramatic and butthurt. Now, should I have involved myself further in such? Debateable. Probably not. Either way though, I found the whole thing rather silly to say the least.
That's bullshit though people ARE judging you on your actions as an admin as I pointed out repeatedly and you still refuse to acknowledge. Also just based by the other context of the way you treated him in that thread and many others what you said would in no way shape or form be construed as a joke as evidenced by the people in the thread even apart from fang calling you out which you just so happen to ignore.
You also proved how unprofessional and condescending to fang you are (mind you this is after you made such a huge deal about professionalism starting this site) by posting some .gif and giving him shit and ignoring his previous post which in the post you just made you spoke about how bad it was he missed a portion of your very poor "joke".
Your responses lack sincerity greatly
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3. I expect people to judge me by my actions as an admin. If they don't like those, fine. But to not like me simply because I'm the current establishment... That's just flat out immature and retarded and I just can't say that I respect that exactly, you know? I do see what you're saying though.
4. See, I find that thread to be really funny because fanglekai singled out the joking part and completely ignored the other part where I gave him some praise for his contribution. Then he started getting very dramatic and butthurt. Now, should I have involved myself further in such? Debateable. Probably not. Either way though, I found the whole thing rather silly to say the least.
That's bullshit though people ARE judging you on your actions as an admin as I pointed out repeatedly and you still refuse to acknowledge. Also just based by the other context of the way you treated him in that thread and many others what you said would in no way shape or form be construed as a joke as evidenced by the people in the thread even apart from fang calling you out which you just so happen to ignore.
You also proved how unprofessional and condescending to fang you are (mind you this is after you made such a huge deal about professionalism starting this site) by posting some .gif and giving him shit and ignoring his previous post which in the post you just made you spoke about how bad it was he missed a portion of your very poor "joke".
Your responses lack sincerity greatly
Judging by his behavior I don't think he wants me or my contributions posted here. It's hilarious how he still tries to use my own trolling against me by calling me butthurt and saying to get TUFF. It's nice to see my influence lives on.
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3. I expect people to judge me by my actions as an admin. If they don't like those, fine. But to not like me simply because I'm the current establishment... That's just flat out immature and retarded and I just can't say that I respect that exactly, you know? I do see what you're saying though.
4. See, I find that thread to be really funny because fanglekai singled out the joking part and completely ignored the other part where I gave him some praise for his contribution. Then he started getting very dramatic and butthurt. Now, should I have involved myself further in such? Debateable. Probably not. Either way though, I found the whole thing rather silly to say the least.
That's bullshit though people ARE judging you on your actions as an admin as I pointed out repeatedly and you still refuse to acknowledge. Also just based by the other context of the way you treated him in that thread and many others what you said would in no way shape or form be construed as a joke as evidenced by the people in the thread even apart from fang calling you out which you just so happen to ignore.
You also proved how unprofessional and condescending to fang you are (mind you this is after you made such a huge deal about professionalism starting this site) by posting some .gif and giving him shit and ignoring his previous post which in the post you just made you spoke about how bad it was he missed a portion of your very poor "joke".
Your responses lack sincerity greatly
I think the only way I haven't been professional is some politeness. And right now, I think I'm being incredibly patient and polite as can be even though you seem to have made it your life's goal to find every single little thing about me that you perceive to be mistakes and are using the site troll as backup. And if you're going to honestly tell me that fang's not trolling right now then I have nothing further to discuss with you.
Every single one of my actions as an admin has been questioned a thousand times by me. We could sit here all day and I could give you a good reason for each and every one of them. But I don't think that's what you want. You just want something to justify all your words against me. Because you don't really sound like someone who's interested in talking and discussing something rationally. You sound like someone who just wants to argue.
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Yeah again you come at me as a troll while continuing to be confrontational and dismissive by still not explaining your actions as you so clearly claim you want to do. I have not stopped you from explaining yourself once you are being very argumentative while blaming me and contrary to your beliefs you are not being professional which I should remind you is a bar you set for yourself not me. I can see you're going to simply ignore and condescend as is your modus operandi. You're doing a very good job proving just how dismissive and poorly adjusted you can be.
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Yeah again you come at me as a troll while continuing to be confrontational and dismissive by still not explaining your actions as you so clearly claim you want to do. I have not stopped you from explaining yourself once you are being very argumentative while blaming me and contrary to your beliefs you are not being professional which I should remind you is a bar you set for yourself not me. I can see you're going to simply ignore and condescend as is your modus operandi. You're doing a very good job proving just how dismissive and poorly adjusted you can be.
Fine then. Bring up another example of supposedly bad admining if you want and I will explain why I did such and such.
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Fine then. Bring up another example of supposedly bad admining if you want and I will explain why I did such and such.
So you're totally going to DISMISS the two instances that I brought up that showed instances of poor interaction you're being a poor admin for that fact alone. This very post of yours is a fine example of bad admining because you STILL are acting as if an explanation and not a behavior change is needed .
But to humor you http://www.intosanctuary.com/index.php?topic=266.0 < the interactions in this thread are pretty piss poor as you blow a VERY small issue into a much larger one in which you caused a lot of confusion in your user base and what can be assumed your mod team also
http://www.intosanctuary.com/index.php?topic=179.0 and in this thread where you imedeatly respond harshly do anyone by claiming they're trolling and even saying you don't take input seriously You better be more descriptive than that if you really expect me to listen to you.
that's not how an admin should behave.
you also go so far as to make a big point of calling 2 of your specific users "threats to the forum" which is laughable and very childish.
Anyways on more interesting subjects...elaborate on 'threats to the forum'
Shiva and Purple Cow to name a few.
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3. I expect people to judge me by my actions as an admin. If they don't like those, fine. But to not like me simply because I'm the current establishment... That's just flat out immature and retarded and I just can't say that I respect that exactly, you know? I do see what you're saying though.
4. See, I find that thread to be really funny because fanglekai singled out the joking part and completely ignored the other part where I gave him some praise for his contribution. Then he started getting very dramatic and butthurt. Now, should I have involved myself further in such? Debateable. Probably not. Either way though, I found the whole thing rather silly to say the least.
That's bullshit though people ARE judging you on your actions as an admin as I pointed out repeatedly and you still refuse to acknowledge. Also just based by the other context of the way you treated him in that thread and many others what you said would in no way shape or form be construed as a joke as evidenced by the people in the thread even apart from fang calling you out which you just so happen to ignore.
You also proved how unprofessional and condescending to fang you are (mind you this is after you made such a huge deal about professionalism starting this site) by posting some .gif and giving him shit and ignoring his previous post which in the post you just made you spoke about how bad it was he missed a portion of your very poor "joke".
Your responses lack sincerity greatly
I think the only way I haven't been professional is some politeness. And right now, I think I'm being incredibly patient and polite as can be even though you seem to have made it your life's goal to find every single little thing about me that you perceive to be mistakes and are using the site troll as backup. And if you're going to honestly tell me that fang's not trolling right now then I have nothing further to discuss with you.
Every single one of my actions as an admin has been questioned a thousand times by me. We could sit here all day and I could give you a good reason for each and every one of them. But I don't think that's what you want. You just want something to justify all your words against me. Because you don't really sound like someone who's interested in talking and discussing something rationally. You sound like someone who just wants to argue.
I troll when I feel like it. I post content when I feel like it. Cry harder.
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So you're totally going to DISMISS the two instances that I brought up that showed instances of poor interaction you're being a poor admin for that fact alone.
Oh yes, you did bring up two didn't you? And the other one was me "being a knob" to my staff. I believe you're referring to edify accidentally deleting not just one but two posts.
The reasons why I was being so harsh was because,
1. He made a serious mistake that other users could and DID try to exploit to get themselves unbanned. The reason why I upheld the ban though was because I trusted him.
2. The staff is held to a rigorous standard. They must be the best of the best. They are the examples for everyone around here. Serious mistakes like this are, of course, serious and cannot just be brushed aside as nothing.
As to the Salsa thread, all that was was fanglekai crying about me picking on him a little. Even Idio teases every once in a while FFS. I hardly believe I have to justify some teasing, no matter how poor you think it was.
But to humor you http://www.intosanctuary.com/index.php?topic=266.0 < the interactions in this thread are pretty piss poor as you blow a VERY small issue into a much larger one in which you caused a lot of confusion in your user base and what can be assumed your mod team also
What are you talking about? That was a LARGE issue long before I made the thread. It was clear that some people were not satisfied with current modding practices. Thus, I feel it was an issue that I needed to personally talk about. And I don't regret doing so either.
http://www.intosanctuary.com/index.php?topic=179.0 and in this thread where you imedeatly respond harshly do anyone by claiming they're trolling and even saying you don't take input seriously You better be more descriptive than that if you really expect me to listen to you.
that's not how an admin should behave.
you also go so far as to make a big point of calling 2 of your specific users "threats to the forum" which is laughable and very childish.
Shiva and Purple Cow to name a few.
Alright then, so for the first part, let's look at it this way. I prepare a logo for the site that I spend a good amount of my time on, make a thread to introduce it and see what everyone thinks, and then I get this:
Dude, that logo is fucking gay.
One does not usually go into a thread, look at someone's hard work, and then take a crap all over it without saying why unless they're trolling. Sorry. Just how I see it.
As to the latter part, Shiva and PurpleCow have expressed in the past possible intents to bring this site down in a very real sense. Pretty sure that can be construed as a threat.
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So you're totally going to DISMISS the two instances that I brought up that showed instances of poor interaction you're being a poor admin for that fact alone.
Oh yes, you did bring up two didn't you? And the other one was me "being a knob" to my staff. I believe you're referring to edify accidentally deleting not just one but two posts.
The reasons why I was being so harsh was because,
1. He made a serious mistake that other users could and DID try to exploit to get themselves unbanned. The reason why I upheld the ban though was because I trusted him.
2. The staff is held to a rigorous standard. They must be the best of the best. They are the examples for everyone around here. Serious mistakes like this are, of course, serious and cannot just be brushed aside as nothing.
As to the Salsa thread, all that was was fanglekai crying about me picking on him a little. Even Idio teases every once in a while FFS. I hardly believe I have to justify some teasing, no matter how poor you think it was.
But to humor you http://www.intosanctuary.com/index.php?topic=266.0 < the interactions in this thread are pretty piss poor as you blow a VERY small issue into a much larger one in which you caused a lot of confusion in your user base and what can be assumed your mod team also
What are you talking about? That was a LARGE issue long before I made the thread. It was clear that some people were not satisfied with current modding practices. Thus, I feel it was an issue that I needed to personally talk about. And I don't regret doing so either.
http://www.intosanctuary.com/index.php?topic=179.0 and in this thread where you imedeatly respond harshly do anyone by claiming they're trolling and even saying you don't take input seriously You better be more descriptive than that if you really expect me to listen to you.
that's not how an admin should behave.
you also go so far as to make a big point of calling 2 of your specific users "threats to the forum" which is laughable and very childish.
Shiva and Purple Cow to name a few.
Alright then, so for the first part, let's look at it this way. I prepare a logo for the site that I spend a good amount of my time on, make a thread to introduce it and see what everyone thinks, and then I get this:
Dude, that logo is fucking gay.
One does not usually go into a thread, look at someone's hard work, and then take a crap all over it without saying why unless they're trolling. Sorry. Just how I see it.
As to the latter part, Shiva and PurpleCow have expressed in the past possible intents to bring this site down in a very real sense. Pretty sure that can be construed as a threat.
Actually no I was talking about the way you accosted him in the Shoutbox then IRC channel (which I stated it was in) in a very unprofessional way after he explained his reasoning you continued to bring it up in front of other users effectively demeaning your staff in front of users which is not how things like that should be handled.
Secondly the issue was very small and your handling of the issue insinuated a much bigger response by A MAJORITY of posts in that thread telling you to relax. Which I may add most of those users are currently not active on the site anymore. Again you seem to think I have a problem with you being harsh or strict in your rules as again I state this is not the case but it is your demeanor on the site that I'm bringing into question which brings me too my next points.
You say shiva gave you shit on your hard work (which by the way your post about your indignation was after there was a pretty good consensus by the users) so how is that not you shitting on the hard work that was fang's guide which even idio admitted in that thread was poor behavior by you.
Then you call out two specific users as threats to the site effectively ostracizing them NO GOOD ADMIN would turn users on other users in some bullshit vague terms as they are threatening the site in such a malicious manner. A GOOD admin would have dealt with the issue with out turning it into a witch hunt.
You bring up this rigorous standard of yours but you fail to follow it yourself. Which again is the point I am raising about your behavior not your motivations behind your behavior.
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As to the latter part, Shiva and PurpleCow have expressed in the past possible intents to bring this site down in a very real sense. Pretty sure that can be construed as a threat.
The "possible intent" was over a comment that I made on Toste2 DarkBB. Oppenheimer had just posted his asshole avatar here. Someone on and at Tostse2 asked him about it. Oppenheimmer said it was a picture of a 13 year old filipina girl (everyone knew it wasn't). Oppenheimmer was then banned here for posting child porn. Oppenheimmer was notified of the ban by Arnox on a thread at Totse2 along with the reason why he was banned. I then made the comment that if I was Oppenheimmer I would torch the site then go looking for the Admin of that site. I still feel the same way.
Guys, we need to get past all of this. A few pages back Idio posted some mighty fine words and it sucks to see them words being dragged thru all of this shit.....Peace! Please!
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As to the latter part, Shiva and PurpleCow have expressed in the past possible intents to bring this site down in a very real sense. Pretty sure that can be construed as a threat.
The "possible intent" was over a comment that I made on Toste2 DarkBB. Oppenheimer had just posted his asshole avatar here. Someone on and at Tostse2 asked him about it. Oppenheimmer said it was a picture of a 13 year old filipina girl (everyone knew it wasn't). Oppenheimmer was then banned here for posting child porn. Oppenheimmer was notified of the ban by Arnox on a thread at Totse2 along with the reason why he was banned. I then made the comment that if I was Oppenheimmer I would torch the site then go looking for the Admin of that site. I still feel the same way.
Guys, we need to get past all of this. A few pages back Idio posted some mighty fine words and it sucks to see them words being dragged thru all of this shit.....Peace! Please!
*shrugs* I think I'll leave this up to Spectre in terms of whether he wants to stop talking about this or not.
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*shrugs* I think I'll leave this up to Spectre in terms of whether he wants to stop talking about this or not.
Maybe when your behavior changes and it stops being detrimental people I have to bring it up
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and it stops being detrimental people I have to bring it up
What? Please rephrase.
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Maybe when your behavior changes and it stops being detrimental *to* people I *won't* have to bring it up
idk how that happened
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I should run this place.
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^agreed