The New Rules (Currently in Beta)

[Lanny]

Lanny, why are you so dead set on allowing the posting of personal information? What legitimate reason would a user have to post another users personal information? If you can think of one it could and should be requested as a special exception to mods on a case by case basis.  The no posting PI rule prevents that very scenario.

Reasons why I oppose the PI rule:
* It doesn't stop PI from actually being posted
* It's one more rule to generate conflicts between staff and posters
* It commodifies personal info so it actually gets posted more
* It generates drama because getting your PI posted is not a big fucking deal
* It's a bitch rule in the first place and make everyone look bad by association

A legitimate use case for "PI" (by the definition of the new rule) is if I wanted to post one of the totse or zoklet collages, I made two of them over the years, it's always fun to look back at them over the years. Things like Malice in his KKK get up at occupy oakland is now PI. If LSD ever registers an account his epic will become PI.

Deleting accounts should also be only permissible by moderators on a case by case basis as arnox said, it could make threads unreadable.

I'm on the fence about account deletion but the point is it makes no sense to implement the PI rule (which obviously doesn't help people who have their PI posted) but not account deletion (which obviously DOES help people who have their PI posted).

What is the logic behind the no advertising rule? I could imagine someone who is aggressively trying to promote something could get annoying with posts about their thing but that could easily be covered by the no spam/flooding rule.

The obvious answer is so sanctuary doesn't lose posters to other forums.

[Lanny]

1. Not very much at all. Not enough to make a difference anyway. All it takes is just one mention of your username anywhere on this forum for someone to confirm that they posted here.

The issue is not being confirmed for posting on sanctuary but rather for doing things we wouldn't want to be made public. Account deletion at least has a solid chance of doing that.

2. That's stretching it honestly and there's still a lot of deniability there even if a particular user does look suspicious.

Would you mind someone posting your handle and the site url on facebook or sending it to an employer? If the answer is yes then my point is made.

3. Why should we take the hit for any rules at all? Because the good of doing so outweighs the bad. And as Mr. High just proved, there are a lot of methods one can gain someone else's PI that are beyond ones control.

I agree! So what good does the PI rule do? None. Obviously none. There is no good to come out of the rule because it doesn't stop shit.

[Arnox]

I would like to know why there is a need for a no bestiality rule? I don't recall ever seeing an influx of furries arriving at Totse or Zoklet, it just seems like a waste of rule space.

What is the logic behind the no advertising rule? I could imagine someone who is aggressively trying to promote something could get annoying with posts about their thing but that could easily be covered by the no spam/flooding rule.

You should remove the rule explaining the 20 post limit, again though necessary - a waste of rule space. just let it exist no need to spell it out. I could see some fags preparing 50 accounts knowing they only has to post 20 times on each one to be able to spam CP for an entire day.

1. Honestly, we're just staying safe since bestiality is illegal in a whole lot of countries including where this site is hosted. I don't want to give prosecutors any more ammo than they already have to shut this site down. And only images and videos of IRL bestiality count anyway.

2. Besides the fact that, as Lanny said, I don't want traffic getting driven away from my site that I've worked hard on and continue to work hard on,  advertisements are just annoying in general, even if it's just a single thread. This isn't a place to sell your wares.

3. Eh. Maybe. I've already gotten some complaints from a couple Outlanders asking why they can't post images yet though.

[-SpectraL]

Sure it stops shit. It gets you banned again and the PI gets removed from public view. What more do you want?

[Arnox]

The issue is not being confirmed for posting on sanctuary but rather for doing things we wouldn't want to be made public. Account deletion at least has a solid chance of doing that.

You're not supposed to admit to any crimes on here in the first place and as to talking about your personal life, that's giving out some PI by itself. Once again, it's on your shoulders.

Would you mind someone posting your handle and the site url on facebook or sending it to an employer?

Nope. Dead serious about that. I really wouldn't care. But there's no way to prove that without actually doing so, so it's a moot point.

I agree! So what good does the PI rule do? None. Obviously none. There is no good to come out of the rule because it doesn't stop shit.

I already explained the benefits of it. It's more than just about stopping PI from getting spread.

[Lanny]

Alright, whatever, I can see you're not going to be convinced here.

[Slave of the Beast]

Does this mean someone can be banned for their post style, e.g. being direct, persistent and ruthless in discussion? I ask because I can imagine a scenario whereby a mod' recommends a user be permabanned because they are consistently 'mean and unfriendly'. On the basis of what I've seen so far on this site I doubt they'd even be required to validate their claim before action was considered.

STFU SpectraL

Truth be told I do think there's some scope for 'executive' decisions to be made. In your case for example the level of out-and-out shitposting is exceptionally high; checking through your last 50 posts is a bit like staring at dead bodies floating down the Ganges.

"This 'ban people who bring the site down' rule it terrible! Whaaaaa! Err... except for when it's someone I dislike"

Style ≠ content.

HTH.

[Arnox]

Alright, whatever, I can see you're not going to be convinced here.

Probably not. I do like having civil debates though for whatever it's worth.

[theKit]

Reasons why I oppose the PI rule:
* It doesn't stop PI from actually being posted
* It's one more rule to generate conflicts between staff and posters
* It commodifies personal info so it actually gets posted more
* It generates drama because getting your PI posted is not a big fucking deal
* It's a bitch rule in the first place and make everyone look bad by association


The obvious answer is so sanctuary doesn't lose posters to other forums.

1) It does stop PI form being posted as the poster is banned and the info is deleted. If you're saying that having the rule doesn't stop the initial post of the PI, sure but that is really being picky and obviously not the goal for the rule. Having speed limits doesn't stop people from speeding, but being ticketed/punished for it certainly discourages it.

2) A person posting pi is generally doing it in a malicious way so that in itself creates the conflict between the user and the staff. If members follow the rules, there is no conflict.  There are less than 10 rules so I don't feel the sanctuaries rules to be lenghty or burdensome.

3) I don't think that's true at all unless you're talking about he butt hurt guy who gets mad because he gets banned for breaking the rules. If this logic was true, all the other rules would also be encouraging breaking of those rules which I'm not seeing. I don't see massive spam or CP by the general population simply because we have rules against those things.

4) It is a big deal to some people. Look at Zok, his PI gets leaked and he shuts down zoklet and makes up some bullshit AIDs story. I would definitely not want my address and phone number accessible to most of the retards on here.

5) You're being silly with that one.

 

[Lanny]

1) It does stop PI form being posted as the poster is banned and the info is deleted. If you're saying that having the rule doesn't stop the initial post of the PI, sure but that is really being picky and obviously not the goal for the rule. Having speed limits doesn't stop people from speeding, but being ticketed/punished for it certainly discourages it.

But the difference to the person whose PI has been posted is non-existent. The damage is done if the PI is up for minutes or for ever because at least one person has it and you don't know who else does. Also PI via PM is trivial. Bans don't discourage it since IP bans don't exist, you just reg a new account and keep on spamming.

2) A person posting pi is generally doing it in a malicious way so that in itself creates the conflict between the user and the staff. If members follow the rules, there is no conflict.  There are less than 10 rules so I don't feel the sanctuaries rules to be lenghty or burdensome.

User/user feuds actually are unavoidable and not particularly harmful. User/mod shit flinging (which is what the PI rule gets you) is destructive on the other hand because the power asymmetry.

3) I don't think that's true at all unless you're talking about he butt hurt guy who gets mad because he gets banned for breaking the rules. If this logic was true, all the other rules would also be encouraging breaking of those rules which I'm not seeing. I don't see massive spam or CP by the general population simply because we have rules against those things.

You'll notice there was actually a run of CP raids fairly recently. Why would anyone spam CP if they weren't breaking the rules to do so?

4) It is a big deal to some people. Look at Zok, his PI gets leaked and he shuts down zoklet and makes up some bullshit AIDs story. I would definitely not want my address and phone number accessible to most of the retards on here.

Sure, I agree. Doesn't change the fact that the pi rule doesn't stop your PI from being available to retards on here.

5) You're being silly with that one.

I disagree.

[DaGuru]

The great thing about this thread, is any new users wanting to find out about the rules, or the implementation of the rules....will see Lanny droning on and on and on for 5+ pages asking the same questions, making the same erroneous arguments, and pouting again and again and again all because he can't take "no" as an answer. Helluva way to show people how immature, stupid, toxic, and outright insane one is....but its a nice commentary/legacy in regard to what Lanny is about, and why he enjoys being on message boards so much.

[-SpectraL]

Also PI via PM is trivial. Bans don't discourage it since IP bans don't exist, you just reg a new account and keep on spamming.

And then all your sock puppets get banned as well until you get bored making them. I don't see the issue. This is the way it's always worked going back decades.

[Jedi Moped]

Also PI via PM is trivial. Bans don't discourage it since IP bans don't exist, you just reg a new account and keep on spamming.

And then all your sock puppets get banned as well until you get bored making them. I don't see the issue. This is the way it's always worked going back decades.

When are you going to get bored with your alts?

[Umbrella Corp]

Shut the fuck up The Dark Cock Sucker

[Jedi Moped]

Shut the fuck up The Dark Cock Sucker

Moms basement