Buddhism General

[equanimity]

What book are you even talking about?

[equanimity]

Also don't call me faggot lol.

[Ninja]

Buddhism is for gays!  Unless, you happen to actually be gay and not just an effeminate heterosexual, because most Buddhists don't like fags! Anal sex is unnatural BECAUSE POOP COMES OUT! 

[Bart the General]

I already told you about it but Ill PM it to you tomorrow I'm too tired right mow and falimg asleep so I tried to potse ;ole splew wje jes all fucked up on syncans but im too garticulate and good at typing

[equanimity]

garticulate

 

[Darkhunter]

Also don't call me faggot lol.

Faggot

[theKit]

OP why are you being a little bitch and hiding the title of the book? If you want to spread the word so badly why be so stingy?

What is your opinion of the SGI? I know nothing of Zen or the other forms of Buddhism but I've been researching Nichiren Buddhism for quite some time. I have major concern with the credibility of modern Buddhism as the original teachings of the Buddha were not written down for thousands of years after his dead, not only that but even while he was alive and teaching there were doctrinal disputes  - even more disputes of the SEVERAL different sects which followed him  and now you have groups that do not study the teacher's teachings but the student's interpretations of his teachings (Nichiren) and then you have the student's "student"'s interpretation (Daisaku Ikeda) and this being THOUSANDS of years between each of these. The separation is too great to be reliable. On top of that there is too much esoteric bullshit clogging up the essence of whats trying to be taught. Buddhist DO in fact believe in God's, and heaven / hell like realms. They just replace the word 'God' with 'Universe' as to detach themselves from an ultimate authority. The thing that really makes me want to say fuck it is the fact that you have teachers contradicting not only each other, but themselves and their supposed teachers. The former sutra's did in fact state women cannot attain Buddhahood and later sutras denounce this teaching. Therefore how can you be sure the teachings you have are true and accurate if the former teachings could be overwritten or proven to be false?

[equanimity]

I have a strict policy not to give my address out to crazy people anyway.  So just post the book and see if any short-sighted people feel like giving you theirs.

OP why are you being a little bitch and hiding the title of the book? If you want to spread the word so badly why be so stingy?

What is your opinion of the SGI? I know nothing of Zen or the other forms of Buddhism but I've been researching Nichiren Buddhism for quite some time. I have major concern with the credibility of modern Buddhism as the original teachings of the Buddha were not written down for thousands of years after his dead, not only that but even while he was alive and teaching there were doctrinal disputes  - even more disputes of the SEVERAL different sects which followed him  and now you have groups that do not study the teacher's teachings but the student's interpretations of his teachings (Nichiren) and then you have the student's "student"'s interpretation (Daisaku Ikeda) and this being THOUSANDS of years between each of these. The separation is too great to be reliable. On top of that there is too much esoteric bullshit clogging up the essence of whats trying to be taught. Buddhist DO in fact believe in God's, and heaven / hell like realms. They just replace the word 'God' with 'Universe' as to detach themselves from an ultimate authority. The thing that really makes me want to say fuck it is the fact that you have teachers contradicting not only each other, but themselves and their supposed teachers. The former sutra's did in fact state women cannot attain Buddhahood and later sutras denounce this teaching. Therefore how can you be sure the teachings you have are true and accurate if the former teachings could be overwritten or proven to be false?

You need to calm down, friend.  Buddhists are very varied in their beliefs.  I know a few that are staunchly atheistic, and of course there are those into the heaven and hell realms of existence.  And yeah there are places (Thailand for one) that don't even like their women becoming bhikkhunis (nuns), but we can't decide to view these cultures with a staunchly Western attitude and expect to understand much of anything about them.  There are movements in those places pushing for gender equality among the Buddhist lineages.  It's really only a matter of time before women are considered equals in all religion imo.

Religion must evolve to keep up with the changing social tides.  Buddhism embraces change as an undeniable fact of life, though it sometimes shows up in ironically discriminatory ways.

[equanimity]

I hear he left his family to wander around as an ascetic.  Was this culturally acceptable back then, in India?

You know, I'm not sure what the cultural climate was like there in the time of the Buddha.  Whenever I hear the story though this piece is always mentioned just in passing or expressed as though he was making a big sacrifice in leaving his family because it was a very comfortable life full of loving family and friends.

It's entirely likely that it was normal for men to leave their families at the time.  Being able to stick in one place if a person so chooses is kind of a modern convenience, though it was said that he was a prince and likely enjoyed monetary wealth and social status exclusively around where he was.  This would be an interesting topic to learn more about.

[equanimity]

What would constitute "unwise" livelihood?  Is it okay to work for a multinational corporation that poisons their consumers and rapes the environment if you're a janitor who takes pride in making the world better one bathroom stall at a time?

Well, this is one of those areas of Buddhism where I feel a person must make a decision on their own.  It's unwise to expect everything to be black and white, and cut into small easily-digestible pieces.  The world is complex, and there are many right answers.

Personally, I feel that intent is a major factor in this matter.  If a person intends to perform acts of goodness and is decidedly harmless in their approach to work, most jobs are okay.  The example you gave was an interesting one, but I think it would be fine to perform that work.  Making the world a cleaner place, even for people who may be "bad" isn't an unwise act in itself.  Could you ever really be contributing to death and destruction if you cleaned bathrooms for a living?  I guess some of those chemicals are harmful and could come from unethical sources, but if we worry over every little thing like that then we'd probably end up too paralyzed with concern to do any good at all.

I've known Buddhists who served in the U.S. military, and that is an altogether more difficult question.  For me, anyway.  It's good you're thinking though.  Question everything!

[theKit]

This is what pisses me off about Buddhism. It's all this opinionated crap that ultimately means nothing. If the law of the universe is that women cannot become Buddha's until they are reincarnated as a man, then that is the law. It should not matter what your culture deems socially acceptable. Your Buddhism is just glorified 'This is what I like or sounds good to me so it is my religion' ism.

Answer my fucking questions, faggot.

[equanimity]

This is what pisses me off about Buddhism. It's all this opinionated crap that ultimately means nothing. If the law of the universe is that women cannot become Buddha's until they are reincarnated as a man, then that is the law. It should not matter what your culture deems socially acceptable. Your Buddhism is just glorified 'This is what I like or sounds good to me so it is my religion' ism.

Answer my fucking questions, faggot.

You're really asking the wrong people.  We're all pseudo-philosophers here, with a poor grasp of these complex topics to boot.  Not that you'd get a better answer on a Buddhist themed forum or anything.  Those places are surprisingly divided.  Most people seem to have their minds made up about these big questions.

What really drew me to Buddhism was that I was told to question it and put it all to the test.

"Don't believe anything just because I'm telling you, as a spiritual teacher.  You shouldn't place your faith in me for any petty reason such as that.  Question everything I say, and get out there and prove me wrong!"

That probably is not the Buddhism is always taught haha.  But it stuck with me.

In all the flavors of Buddhism I've learned about though, the core beliefs were always the same.  It's about the cessation of suffering.  Some lineages don't seem to even discuss the four noble truths much at all, but it's all there anyway in everything they teach.  Saying that women can never attain enlightenment is no small thing, but when compared with the overarching themes is actually kind of is.  And those basic teachings haven't really changed since their inception, largely because they're so simple (or not really, but you understand right?).

1. Suffering exists.
2. Suffering exists because of craving, or unhealthy attachment.
3. There is a way to end suffering.
4. This is the way to end suffering: Eightfold Path, wise way of living one's life, etc.

[Tokolosh]

Not really delved deep into Buddhism. While strives to teach good sentiments, it's still a system.

The best thing I've plucked from Buddism is the meaning of the laughing Buddha; His eyes are closed because he is looking within, laughing his ass off at his own absurdity.

Not enough people know how to do that. One of the best things about acid induced introspection is the freedom of being able to laugh at say, your day-to-day trivial vexations, and truely realise how insignificant they are.

[theKit]

1. Suffering exists.
2. Suffering exists because of craving, or unhealthy attachment.
3. There is a way to end suffering.
4. This is the way to end suffering: Eightfold Path, wise way of living one's life, etc.
[/quote]

Funny thing; The Soka Gakkai branch of Nichren Buddhism teach that desire is necessary and that to strive to eliminate it is futile. They instead try to use their desire as motivation to achieve their goals in life; in order to be happy thus ending suffering...(?)

This really turned me off to Buddhism because I personally feel their philosophy is destructive. The 'take care of yourself first so you can take care of others' thing seems dangerous and feels more like an excuse to be selfish or greedy. The problem with desire is that like greed, it never ceases. At what point does one switch from 'I must acquire and achieve at all costs' to 'ok i've acquired enough or am satisfied with my life condition, time to help others'? There also is little emphasis on building character so an evil person who hears this 'do for yourself... achieve... this method will guarantee you success' will take that and do evil things with it.

As for the 'dont take my word for it try it yourself' thing, that is standard even in Christianity. I heard that the very first time I spoke to at least 5 different instructors. The only good thing about Buddhism that I've gotten is the understanding of PERSPECTIVE. It's everything. The way you see the world determines how happy you are. They just brain wash you into believing their methods (which are actually amount to nothing more than insane persistence) is doing something special and when you fail they teach you to make up an esoteric lesson learned excuse for your failure, and then tell you to move on.

[equanimity]

Funny thing; The Soka Gakkai branch of Nichren Buddhism teach that desire is necessary and that to strive to eliminate it is futile. They instead try to use their desire as motivation to achieve their goals in life; in order to be happy thus ending suffering...(?)

This really turned me off to Buddhism because I personally feel their philosophy is destructive. The 'take care of yourself first so you can take care of others' thing seems dangerous and feels more like an excuse to be selfish or greedy. The problem with desire is that like greed, it never ceases. At what point does one switch from 'I must acquire and achieve at all costs' to 'ok i've acquired enough or am satisfied with my life condition, time to help others'? There also is little emphasis on building character so an evil person who hears this 'do for yourself... achieve... this method will guarantee you success' will take that and do evil things with it.

As for the 'dont take my word for it try it yourself' thing, that is standard even in Christianity. I heard that the very first time I spoke to at least 5 different instructors. The only good thing about Buddhism that I've gotten is the understanding of PERSPECTIVE. It's everything. The way you see the world determines how happy you are. They just brain wash you into believing their methods (which are actually amount to nothing more than insane persistence) is doing something special and when you fail they teach you to make up an esoteric lesson learned excuse for your failure, and then tell you to move on.

I know nothing of Nichren Buddhism.  Can you say more about the desire thing?

As I learned it, desire in and of itself isn't detrimental to those goals of ending suffering.  And it is impossible to eliminate.  If we lacked all desire we wouldn't even be motivated to do even good things, right?  I tried to be careful with my language here, in saying "craving, or unhealthy attachment."

Craving to me is a step beyond desire.  It feels like a need, when it really isn't.  Holding onto an idea, person, or thing for dear life.  Wanting so badly it consumes you.  Maybe that line between desire and craving is a little blurred, and I bet it varies from person to person.  But I would never (mindfully) say that all desire is unwise.

About the rest, hmm.  I learned that focusing on your own individual salvation is an act of kindness to everyone around you, and actually a very important step toward saving the world.  If you're calm and of sober mind, doesn't that automatically make you a better friend, and son or daughter?  To me it seems like it could go a long way in teaching others about the benefits of such things as equanimity and loving kindness.  It's not like improving yourself and helping other people are two mutually exclusive things.  Quite the opposite, actually...

Working to become a better person isn't greedy or selfish.

Back to desire... desire doesn't exist.  It's not a solid thing we can touch, it's just an idea we invented which exists because we will it to.  It's neither good nor bad, and any such extrapolation is just an exercise in delusion.  Any philosophy can be destructive if you stare at it long enough.  In Buddhism we're supposed to be developing sharp and discerning minds, that allow us to truly understand the human invention of desire and know when and where it is helpful, and when and where it is not.

I have no idea what you mean when you say that Buddhism says nothing about character building.  The entire thing is character building.