The Truth about Voting

[starvingniglet]

Of course you have a right to complain if you vote, people do this all the time (and for good reason) when their political representative backflip on election promises and core policies for whatever reason. Simply giving legitimacy to the system by participating in it does not disqualify your right to complain or mean that you agreed to an outcome that wasn't on the table at the time of voting.

I'd also argue that political representatives in a liberal democracy have some sort of obligation to their voters, as they purport to represent them, were elected on the basis that they would try and achieve the obligations set for themselves in policy and rhetoric, and face the prospect of being held to account at the next election if they fail to perform. Of course some individuals will abandon their electorate's interests after gaining power, but it's a stretch to claim that political representatives have absolutely no obligation to the constituents of their electorate in a liberal democratic system - they do, but it's an individual choice as to how far they pursue these obligations, if at all. In this regard politicians are a mixed bag.

The US is supposed to be a republic, not a 'liberal democracy'.

[Umbrella Corp]

The 2 party system has been completely corrupted for a long ass time now.  Probably since the civil war.

Seriously our system is so easily manipulated.  I was brought up to believe anyone can be president if they try hard enough.  What a load of donkey shit.  When we elect somebody for president is is not rich and who has no connections to others in high government positions, I will believe in the system.

We americans are fucking blind masochists, time after time electing ppl to represent us who have NO IDEA what it means to work for a living, have no idea what it's like to live a day in the real world.  We are given the THINLY veiled illusion of a choice between 2 people.. give me a break.  Case in point, Obama.  I know there are plenty of haters out there who think he has turned the US into a communist wasteland but really he didn't do SHIT.  Republicans blocked him at every turn.. do I think if Repubs went along with him that the country really would have changed?  Not a chance.  The powers that be know what is going to happen before it ever comes up for a vote. Obama hasn't done SHIT.  But to be fair, neither would Romney or Mccaine. 

This world is fuckkkked up.  N it is going to take some uncomfortable sacrifices to get back on the right track.  Problem is these sacrifices aren't good politics.  So whoever gets into power is going to kick the can down the road, and the people will turn a blind eye, until ruin grabs us by the balls so that we cannot ignore it any longer and all I can say is sorry to the people of the future but I hope I'm not alive when shit goes down. 

[FON]

Of course you have a right to complain if you vote, people do this all the time (and for good reason) when their political representative backflip on election promises and core policies for whatever reason. Simply giving legitimacy to the system by participating in it does not disqualify your right to complain or mean that you agreed to an outcome that wasn't on the table at the time of voting.

I'd also argue that political representatives in a liberal democracy have some sort of obligation to their voters, as they purport to represent them, were elected on the basis that they would try and achieve the obligations set for themselves in policy and rhetoric, and face the prospect of being held to account at the next election if they fail to perform. Of course some individuals will abandon their electorate's interests after gaining power, but it's a stretch to claim that political representatives have absolutely no obligation to the constituents of their electorate in a liberal democratic system - they do, but it's an individual choice as to how far they pursue these obligations, if at all. In this regard politicians are a mixed bag.

The US is supposed to be a republic, not a 'liberal democracy'.

Uhh, yeah, they aren't mutually exclusive. A republic can still be democratic.

[Prometheus]

This guy is obnoxious. I stopped paying attention 3 minute in, because I've heard this rant before. Which isn't to say he's completely wrong. Federal elections are a fucking joke. I've been filing write in protest votes for the past few elections. Vermin Supreme for President!

Local elections absolutely matter though. I get involved in some of the local campaigns, judges, school board, etc. Your vote can make your city or county a tangibly better place. When the local library lost a lot of their funding, I canvassed the damn city pushing for a millage increase, and helped convince a lot of people that it was a thing worthy of their tax dollars.

[aldra]

Of course you have a right to complain if you vote, people do this all the time (and for good reason) when their political representative backflip on election promises and core policies for whatever reason. Simply giving legitimacy to the system by participating in it does not disqualify your right to complain or mean that you agreed to an outcome that wasn't on the table at the time of voting.

most people don't keep putting their hand on the stove after they've been burned.

the thing that irks me most about voting is the two-party system - in most cases it's a two-horse race where both horses are fundamentally the same, and they both rape you afterwards.

[FON]

Of course you have a right to complain if you vote, people do this all the time (and for good reason) when their political representative backflip on election promises and core policies for whatever reason. Simply giving legitimacy to the system by participating in it does not disqualify your right to complain or mean that you agreed to an outcome that wasn't on the table at the time of voting.

most people don't keep putting their hand on the stove after they've been burned.

the thing that irks me most about voting is the two-party system - in most cases it's a two-horse race where both horses are fundamentally the same, and they both rape you afterwards.

Yeah, the two-party system definitely sucks. I personally prefer the idea of a multi-party system, although obviously any party system has pros and cons.

[Prometheus]

Besides the fact that in a lot of places there are laws against going on the ballot if you aren't one of the two major parties (talk about undemocratic!), one of the major problems is the 'first past the post' system of American elections. No one votes third party, because they're afraid of wasting their vote, and hurting the side they don't hate most.

You know that if we had a ballot system where you could, for example, rank candidates with first place getting three votes, second getting two, third getting one (a proposal I've seen), the major parties would be doomed in short order.

[RustyShackleford]

The thing about the two party system is that it either a. forms naturally when we are left to our democratic principals or b. It was formed intentionally because it serves the elite. Either way we're fucked and either way we have no say.

That being said. I'm done. I'm voting obama. Fucking naysayers telling me he can't get a third term.

[Prometheus]

Fuck Obama, I'm voting a Gore/Warren ticket next election. Hell, I'd rather vote for Reagan's corpse than Hillary, Reagan was a better democrat than she'll ever be.

[FON]

The thing about the two party system is that it either a. forms naturally when we are left to our democratic principals

Although most developed nations contain liberal, as well as democratic, elements that may be seen as being more conducive to a multi-party system.